Showing posts with label linguistics. Show all posts
Showing posts with label linguistics. Show all posts

06 April 2011

Seeding, transduction, out-of-sample error and the Microsoft approach...

My past master's student Adam Teichert (now at JHU) did some work on inducing part of speech taggers using typological information.  We wanted to compare the usefulness of using small amounts of linguistic information with small amounts of lexical information in the form of seeds.  (Other papers give seeds different names, like initial dictionaries or prototypes or whatever... it's all the same basic idea.)

The basic result was that if you don't use seeds, then typological information can help a lot.  If you do you seeds, then your baseline performance jumps from like 5% to about 40% and then using typological information on top of this isn't really that beneficial.

This was a bit frustrating, and led us to think more about the problem.  The way we got seeds was to look at the wikipedia page about Portuguese (for instance) and use their example list of words for each tag.  An alternative popular way is to use labeled data and extract the few most frequent words for each part of speech type.  They're not identical, but there is definitely quite a bit of overlap between the words that Wikipedia lists as examples of determiners and the most frequent determiners (this correlation is especially strong for closed-class words).

In terms of end performance, there are two reasons seeds can help.  The first, which is the interesting case, is that knowing that "the" is a determiner helps you find other determiners (like "a") and perhaps also nouns (for instance, knowing the determiners often precede nouns in Portuguese).  The second, which is the uninteresting case, is that now every time you see one of your seeds, you pretty much always get it right.  In other words, just by specifying seeds, especially by frequency (or approximately by frequency ala Wikipedia), you're basically ensuring that you get 90% accuracy (due to ambiguity) on some large fraction of the corpus (again, especially for closed-class words which have short tails).

This phenomena is mentioned in the text (but not the tables :P), for instance, in Haghighi & Klein's 2006 NAACL paper on prototype-driven POS tagging, wherein they say: "Adding prototypes ... gave an accuracy of 68.8% on all tokens, but only 47.7% on non-prototype occurrences, which is only a marginal improvement over [a baseline system with no prototypes."  Their improved system remedies this and achieves better accuracy on non-prototypes as well as prototypes (aka seeds).

This is very similar to the idea of transductive learning in machine learning land.  Transduction is an alternative to semi-supervised learning.  The setting is that you get a bunch of data, some of which is labeled and some of which is unlabeled.  Your goal is to simply label the unlabeled data.  You need not "induce" the labeling function (though many approach do, in passing).

The interesting thing is that learning with seeds is very similar to transductive learning, though perhaps with a bit stronger assumption of noise on the "labeled" part.  The irony is that in machine learning land, you would never report "combined training and test accuracy" -- this would be ridiculous.  Yet this is what we seem to like to do in NLP land.  This is itself related to an old idea in machine learning wherein you rate yourself only on test example that you didn't see at training time.  This is your out-of-sample error, and is obviously much harder than your standard generalization error.  (The famous no-free-lunch theorems are from an out-of-sample analysis.)  The funny thing out of sample error is that sometimes you prefer not to get more training examples, because you then know you won't be tested on it!  If you were getting it right already, this just hurts you.  (Perhaps you should be allowed to see x and say "no I don't want to see y"?)

I think the key question is: what are we trying to do.  If we're trying to build good taggers (i.e., we're engineers) then overall accuracy is what we care about and including "seed" performance in our evaluations make sense.  But when we're talking about 45% tagging accuracy (like Adam and I were), then this is a pretty pathetic claim.  In the case that we're trying to understand learning algorithms and study their performance on real data (i.e., we're scientists) then accuracy on non-seeds is perhaps more interesting.  (Please don't jump on me for the engineer/scientist distinction: it's obviously much more subtle than this.)

This also reminds me of something Eric Brill said to me when I was working with him as a summer intern in MLAS at Microsoft (back when MLAS existed and back when Eric was in MLAS....).  We were working on web search stuff.  His comment was that he really didn't care about doing well on the 1000 most frequent queries.  Microsoft could always hire a couple annotators to manually do a good job on these queries.  And in fact, this is what is often done.  What we care about is the heavy tail, where there are too many somewhat common things to have humans annotate them all.  This is precisely the same situation here.  I can easily get 1000 seeds for a new language.  Do I actually care how well I do on those, or do I care how well I do on the other 20000+ things?

17 February 2010

Senses versus metaphors

I come from a tradition of not really believing in word senses. I fondly remember a talk Ed Hovy gave when I was a grad student. He listed the following example sentences and asked each audience member to group them in to senses:

  1. John drove his car to work.
  2. We dove to the university every morning.
  3. She drove me to school every day.
  4. He drives me crazy.
  5. She is driven by her passion.
  6. He drove the enemy back.
  7. She finally drove him to change jobs.
  8. He drove a nail into the wall.
  9. Bill drove the ball far out into the field.
  10. My students are driving away at ACL papers.
  11. What are you driving at?
  12. My new truck drives well.
  13. He drives a taxi in New York.
  14. The car drove around the corner.
  15. The farmer drove the cows into the barn.
  16. We drive the turnpike to work.
  17. Sally drove a golf ball clear across the green.
  18. Mary drove the baseball with the bat.
  19. We drove a tunnel through the hill.
  20. The steam drives the engine in the train.
  21. We drove the forest looking for game.
  22. Joe drove the game from their hiding holes.
Most people in the audience came up with 5 or 6 senses. One came up with two (basically the physical versus mental distinction). According to wordnet, each of these is a separate sense. (And this is only for the verb form!) A common "mistake" people made was to group 1, 2, 3, 13 and 14, all of which seem to have to do with driving cars. The key distinction is that 1 expresses the operation of the vehicle, 2 expresses being transported, 3 expresses being caused to move and 13 expresses driving for a job. You can read the full WordNet descriptions if you don't believe me.

Now, the point of this isn't to try to argue that WordNet is wacky in any way. The people who put it together really know what they're talking about. After all, these senses are all really different, in the sense there really is a deep interprative difference between 1, 2, 3 and 13. It's just sufficiently subtle that unless it's pointed out to you, it's not obvious. There's been a lot of work recently from Ed and others on "consolidating" senses in the OntoNotes project: in fact, they have exactly the same example (how convenient) where they've grouped the verb drive in to seven senses, rather than 22. These are:
  1. operating or traveling via a vehicle (WN 1, 2, 3, 12, 13, 14, 16)
  2. force to a position or stance (WN 4, 6, 7, 8, 15, 22)
  3. exert energy on behalf of something (WN 5, 10)
  4. cause object to move rapidly by striking it (WN 9, 17, 18)
  5. a directed course of conversation (WN 11)
  6. excavate horizontally, as in mining (WN 19)
  7. cause to function or operate (WN 20)
Now, again, I'm not here to argue that these are better or worse or anything in comparison to WordNet.

The point is that there are (at least) two ways of explaining the wide senses of a word like "drive." One is through senses and this is the typical approach, at least in NLP land. The other is metaphor (and yes, that is a different Mark Johnson). I'm not going to go so far as to claim that everything is a metaphor, but I do think it provides an alternative perspective on this issue. And IMO, alternative perspectives, if plausible, are always worth looking at.

Let's take a really simple "off the top of my head" example based on "drive." Let's unrepentantly claim that there is exactly one sense of drive. Which one? It seems like the most reasonable is probably OntoNotes' sense 2; Merriam-Webster claims that drive derives from Old-High-German "triban" which, from what I can tell in about a five minute search, has more to do with driving cattle than anything else. (But even if I'm wrong, this is just a silly example.)
  1. Obviously we don't drive cars like we drive cattle. For one, we're actually inside the cars. But the whole point of driving cattle is to get them to go somewhere. If we think of cars as metaphorical cattle, then by operating them, we are "driving" them (in the drive-car sense).
  2. These are mostly literal. However, for "drive a nail", we need to think of the nail as like a cow that we're trying to get into a pen (the wall).
  3. This is, I think, the most clear metaphorical usage. "He is driving away at his thesis" really means that he's trying to get his thesis to go somewhere (where == to completion).
  4. Driving balls is like driving cattle, except you have to work harder to do it because they aren't self-propelled. This is somewhat like driving nails.
  5. "What are you driving at" is analogous to driving-at-thesis to me.
  6. "Drive a tunnel through the mountain" is less clear to me. But it's also not a sense of this word that I think I have ever used or would ever use. So I can't quite figure it out.
  7. "Steam drives an engine" is sort of a double metaphor. Engine is standing in for cow and steam is standing in for cowboy. But otherwise it's basically the same as driving cattle.
Maybe this isn't the greatest example, but hopefully at least it's a bit thought-worthy. (And yes, I know I'm departing from Lakoff... in a Lakoff style, there's always a concrete thing and a non-concrete thing in the Lakoff setup from what I understand.)

This reminds me of the annoying thing my comrades and I used to do as children. "I come from a tradition..." Yields "You literally come from a tradition?" (No, I was educated in such a tradition.... although even that you could ask whether I was really inside a tradition.) "A talk Ed Hovy gave..." Yields "Ed literally gave a talk?" (No, he spoke to an audience.) "I drove the golf ball across the field" Yields "You got in the golf ball and drove it across the field?" Sigh. Kids are annoying.

Why should I care which analysis I use (senses or metaphor)? I'm not sure. It's very rare that I actually feel like I'm being seriously hurt by the word sense issue, and it seems that if you want to use sense to do a real task like translation, you have to depart from human-constructed sense inventories anyway.

But I can imagine a system roughly like the following. First, find the verb and it's frame and true literal meaning (maybe it actually does have more than one). This verb frame will impose some restrictions on its arguments (for instance, drive might say that both the agent and theme have to be animate). If you encounter something where this is not true (eg., a "car" as a theme or "passion" as an agent), you know that this must be a metaphorical usage. At this point, you have to deduce what it must mean. That is, if we have some semantics associated with the literal interpretation, we have to figure out how to munge it to work in the metaphorical case. For instance, for drive, we might say that the semantics are roughly "E = theme moves & E' = theme executes E & agent causes E'" If the patient cannot actually execute things (it's a nail), then we have to figure that something else (eg., in this case, the agent) did the actual executing. Etc.

So it seems like the options are: come up with semantics and frames for every sense (this is what's done, eg., in VerbNet). Or, have a single (or small number) of semantics and frames and have some generic rules (hopefully generic!) for how to derive metaphorical uses from them.

07 November 2009

NLP as a study of representations

Ellen Riloff and I run an NLP reading group pretty much every semester. Last semester we covered "old school NLP." We independently came up with lists of what we consider some of the most important ideas (idea = paper) from pre-1990 (most are much earlier) and let students select which to present. There was a lot of overlap between Ellen's list and mine (not surprisingly). If people are interested, I can provide the whole list (just post a comment and I'll dig it up). The whole list of topics is posted as a comment. The topics that were actually selected are here.

I hope the students have found this exercise useful. It gets you thinking about language in a way that papers from the 2000s typically do not. It brings up a bunch of issues that we no longer think about frequently. Like language. (Joking.) (Sort of.)

One thing that's really stuck out for me is how much "old school" NLP comes across essentially as a study of representations. Perhaps this is a result of the fact that AI -- as a field -- was (and, to some degree, still is) enamored with knowledge representation problems. To be more concrete, let's look at a few examples. It's already been a while since I read these last (I had meant to write this post during the spring when things were fresh in my head), so please forgive me if I goof a few things up.

I'll start with one I know well: Mann and Thompson's rhetorical structure theory paper from 1988. This is basically "the" RST paper. I think that when a many people think of RST, they think of it as a list of ways that sentences can be organized into hierarchies. Eg., this sentence provides background for that one, and together they argue in favor of yet a third. But this isn't really where RST begins. It begins by trying to understand the communicative role of text structure. That is, when I write, I am trying to communicate something. Everything that I write (if I'm writing "well") is toward that end. For instance, in this post, I'm trying to communicate that old school NLP views representation as the heart of the issue. This current paragraph is supporting that claim by providing a concrete example, which I am using to try to convince you of my claim.

As a more detailed example, take the "Evidence" relation from RST. M+T have the following characterization of "Evidence." Herein, "N" is the nucleus of the relation, "S" is the satellite (think of these as sentences), "R" is the reader and "W" is the writer:

relation name: Evidence
constraints on N: R might not believe N to a degree satisfactory to W
constraints on S: R believes S or will find it credible
constraints on N+S: R's comprehending S increases R's belief of N
the effect: R's belief of N is increased
locus of effect: N
This is a totally different way from thinking about things than I think we see nowadays. I kind of liken it to how I tell students not to program. If you're implementing something moderately complex (say, forward/backward algorithm), first write down all the math, then start implementing. Don't start implementing first. I think nowadays (and sure, I'm guilty!) we see a lot of implementing without the math. Or rather, with plenty of math, but without a representational model of what it is that we're studying.

The central claim of the RST paper is that one can think of texts as being organized into elementary discourse units, and these are connected into a tree structure by relations like the one above. (Or at least this is my reading of it.) That is, they have laid out a representation of text and claimed that this is how texts get put together.

As a second example (this will be sorter), take Wendy Lehnert's 1982 paper, "Plot units and narrative summarization." Here, the story is about how stories get put together. The most interesting thing about the plot units model to me is that it breaks from how one might naturally think about stories. That is, I would naively think of a story as a series of events. The claim that Lehnert makes is that this is not the right way to think about it. Rather, we should think about stories as sequences of affect states. Effectively, an affect state is how a character is feeling at any time. (This isn't quite right, but it's close enough.) For example, Lehnert presents the following story:
When John tried to start his care this morning, it wouldn't turn over. He asked his neighbor Paul for help. Paul did something to the carburetor and got it going. John thanked Paul and drove to work.
The representation put forward for this story is something like: (1) negative-for-John (the car won't start), which leads to (2) motivation-for-John (to get it started, which leads to (3) positive-for-John (it's started), when then links back and resolves (1). You can also analyze the story from Paul's perspective, and then add links that go between the two characters showing how things interact. The rest of the paper describes how these relations work, and how they can be put together into more complex event sequences (such as "promised request bungled"). Again, a high level representation of how stories work from the perspective of the characters.

So now I, W, hope that you, R, have an increased belief in the title of the post.

Why do I think this is interesting? Because at this point, we know a lot about how to deal with structure in language. From a machine learning perspective, if you give me a structure and some data (and some features!), I will learn something. It can even be unsupervised if it makes you feel better. So in a sense, I think we're getting to a point where we can go back, look at some really hard problems, use the deep linguistic insights from two decades (or more) ago, and start taking a crack at things that are really deep. Of course, features are a big problem; as a very wise man once said to me: "Language is hard. The fact that statistical association mining at the word level made it appear easy for the past decade doesn't alter the basic truth. :-)." We've got many of the ingredients to start making progress, but it's not going to be easy!

21 July 2009

Non-parametric as memorizing, in exactly the wrong way?

There is a cool view of the whole non-parametric Bayes thing that I think is very instructive. It's easiest to see in the case of the Pitman-Yor language modeling work by Frank Wood and Yee Whye Teh. The view is "memorize what you can, and back off (to a parametric model) when you can't." This is basically the "backoff" view... where NP Bayes comes in is to control the whole "what you can" aspect. In other words, if you're doing language modeling, try to memorize two grams; but if you haven't seen enough to be confident in your memorization, back off to one grams; and if you're not confident there, back off to a uniform distribution (which is our parametric model -- the base distribution).

Or, if you think about the state-splitting PCFG work (done both at Berkeley and at Stanford), basically what's going on is that we're memorizing as many differences of tree labels as we can, and then backing off to the "generic" label when memorization fails. Or if we look at Trevor Cohn's NP-Bayes answer to DOP, we see a similar thing: memorize big tree chunks, but if you can't, fall back to a simple CFG (our parametric model).

Now, the weird thing is that this mode of memorization is kind of backwards from how I (as an outsider) typically interpret cognitive models (any cogsci people out there, feel free to correct me!). If you take, for instance, morphology, there's evidence that this is exactly not what humans do. We (at least from a popular science) perspective, basically memorize simple rules and then remember exceptions. That is, we remember that to make the past tense of a verb, we add "-ed" (the sound, not the characters) but for certain verbs, we don't: go/went, do/did, etc. You do little studies where you ask people to inflect fake words and they generally follow the rule, not the exceptions (but see * below).

If NP Bayes had its way on this problem (or at least if the standard models I'm familiar with had their way), they would memorize "talk" -> "talked" and "look" -> "looked" and so on because they're so familiar. Sure, it would still memorize the exceptions, but it would also memorize the really common "rule cases too... why? Because of course it could fall back to the parametric model, but these are so common that the standard models would really like to take advantage of the rich-get-richer phenomenon on things like DPs, thus saving themselves cost by memorizing a new "cluster" for each common word. (Okay, this is just my gut feeling about what such models would do, but I think it's at least defensible.) Yes, you could turn the DP "alpha" parameter down, but I guess I'm just not convinced this would do the right thing. Maybe I should just implement such a beast but, well, this is a blog post, not a *ACL paper :P.

Take as an alternative example the language modeling stuff. Basically what it says is "if you have enough data to substantiate memorizing a 5 gram, you should probably memorize a 5 gram." But why? If you could get the same effect with a 2 or 3 gram, why waste the storage/time?!

I guess you could argue "your prior is wrong," which is probably true for most of these models. In which case I guess the question is "what prior does what I want?" I don't have a problem with rich get richer -- in fact, I think it's good in this case. I also don't have a problem with a logarithmic growth rate in the number of exceptions (though I'd be curious how this holds up empirically -- in general, I'm a big fan of checking if your prior makes sense; for instance, Figure 3 (p16) of my supervised clustering paper). I just don't like the notion of memorizing when you don't have to.

(*) I remember back in grad school a linguist from Yale came and gave a talk at USC. Sadly, I can't remember who it was: if anyone wants to help me out, I'd really appreciate it! The basic claim of the talk is that humans actually memorize a lot more than we give them credit for. The argument was in favor of humans basically memorizing all morphology and not backing off to rules like "add -ed." One piece of evidence in favor of this was timing information for asking people to inflect words: the timing seemed to indicate a linear search through a long list of words that could possibly be inflected. I won't say much more about this because I'm probably already misrepresenting it, but it's an interesting idea. And, if true, maybe the NP models are doing exactly what they should be doing!

05 July 2009

Small changes beget good or bad examples?

If you compare vision research with NLP research, there are a lot of interesting parallels. Like we both like linear models. And conditional random fields. And our problems are a lot harder than binary classification. And there are standard data sets that we've been evaluating on for decades and continue to evaluate on (I'm channeling Bob here :P).

But there's one thing that happens, the difference of which is so striking, that I'd like to call it to center stage. It has to do with "messing with our inputs."

I'll spend a bit more time describing the vision approach, since it's probably less familiar to the average reader. Suppose I'm trying to handwriting recognition to identify digits from zero to nine (aka MNIST). I get, say, 100 labeled zeros, 100 labeled ones, 100 labeled twos and so on. So a total of 1000 data points. I can train any off the shelf classifier based on pixel level features and get some reasonable performance (maybe 80s-90s, depending).

Now, I want to insert knowledge. The knowledge that I want to insert is some notion of invariance. I.e., if I take an image of a zero and translate it left a little bit, it's still a zero. Or up a little bit. Of if I scale it up 10%, it's still a zero. Or down 10%. Or if I rotate it five degrees. Or negative five. All zeros. Same hold for all the other digits.

One way to insert this knowledge is to muck with the learning algorithm. That's too complicated for me: I want something simpler. So what I'll do is take my 100 zeros and 100 ones and so on and just manipulate them a bit. That is, I'll sample a random zero, and apply some small random transformations to it, and call it another labeled example, also a zero. Now I have 100,000 training points. I train my off the shelf classifier based on pixel level features and get 99% accuracy or more. The same trick works for other vision problem (eg., recognizing animals). (This process is so common that it's actually described in Chris Bishop's new-ish PRML book!)

This is what I mean by small changes (to the input) begetting good example. A slightly transformed zero is still a zero.

Of course, you have to be careful. If you rotate a six by 180 degrees, you get a nine. If you rotate a cat by 180 degrees, you get an unhappy cat. More seriously, if you're brave, you might start looking at a class of transformations called diffeomorphisms, which are fairly popular around here. These are nice because of their nice mathematical properties, but un-nice because they can be slightly too flexible for certain problems.

Now, let's go over to NLP land. Do we ever futz with our inputs?

Sure!

In language modeling, we'll sometimes permute words or replace one word with another to get a negative example. Noah Smith futzed with his inputs in contrastive estimation to produce negative examples by swapping adjacent words, or deleting words.

In fact, try as I might, I cannot think of a single case in NLP where we make small changes to an input to get another good input: we always do it to get a bad input!

In a sense, this means that one thing that vision people have that we don't have is a notion of semantics preserving transformations. Sure, linguists (especially those from that C-guy) study transformations. And there's a vague sense that work in paraphrasing leads to transformations that maintain semantic equivalence. But the thing is that we really don't know any transformations that preserve semantics. Moreover, some transformations that seem benign (eg., passivization) actually are not: one of my favorite papers at NAACL this year by Greene and Resnik showed that syntactic structure affects sentiment (well, them, drawing on a lot of psycholinguistics work)!

I don't have a significant point to this story other than it's kind of weird. I mentioned this to some people at ICML and got a reaction that replacing words with synonyms should be fine. I remember doing this in high school, when word processors first started coming with thesauri packed in. The result seemed to be that if I actually knew the word I was plugging in, life was fine... but if not, it was usually a bad replacement. So this seems like something of a mixed bag: depending on how liberal you are with defining "synonym" you might be okay do this, but you might also not be.

19 October 2007

Gender and text, gender and speech

For some crazy reason I decided a while ago that I wanted to learn Japanese. Essentially, I wanted to learn a language as unlike English as I could find. So I did some summer intensive thing before college (that amounted to a year of class) and then continued taking class for all three years of undergrad. At the end, I could get by passably for most conversation topics (business, politics, current events, etc.) other than research stuff (at some point I learned how to say NLP, but I don't remember anymore...I wonder if en-eru-pi would be understood...). During the whole time we were required to meet weekly with conversation partners so as to practice our speaking skills.

For the first "semester" during the summer, I had a male professor. For all remaining seven semesters, my profs were female. With the exception of one conversation partner (who was from Hokkaido and spoke quicky with a strong accent and who was quickly replaced by someone who I could understand a bit more), all of my conversation partners were female.

At the end of my four years, I was speaking to a frien (who was neither a conversation partner nor a prof) in Japanese and after about three turns of conversation, he says to me (roughly): "you talk like a girl."

Based on the set up of this post, you may have seen that coming. But the thing that is most interesting is that Japanese is not one of those languages where the speaker's gender is encoded in (eg.) verb morphology. In fact, as best I could tell at that point, the only thing that I did that was effeminate was to use too many sentence ending particles that were more commonly used by women (-ka-na, I think, was one, but it's been too long now to really remember). The guy who said this to me was a close enough friend that I tried to figure out what it was about my speech that made him assess that I talk like a girl. The sentence particle thing was part of it, but he said that there was also something else that he couldn't really figure out; he was hypothesizing it was something to do with emphasis patterns.

It's not at all surprising that given that the majority of native speakers that I talked to were female, that if there were some underlying bias that was sufficiently subtle that the profs weren't able to intentially avoid it, that I would have picked it up.

Now, getting back to en-eru-pi. There's been a reasonable amount of work in the past few years on identifying the gender of the authors of texts. I know both Moshe Koppel and Shlomo Argamon, to name two, have worked on this problem. I also remember seeing a web site a year or so ago where you could enter a few sentences that you wrote and it would guess your gender. I don't remember what it cued off of---i think distribution of types of verbs and adjectives, mostly, but I do remember that given a short paragraph, it's shockingly accurate.

What I don't know is (a) if anyone has done this for something other than English and (b) if someone has done it for speech. Of course, if you have speech, you have extra information (eg., pitch) which might be useful. But given my Japanese friend's reaction to my speech pattern (my voice is rather low), there has to be more going on. And I'm not convinced that what is going on will be the same between written text and (say) transcribed speech. If someone wanted to try such an experiment for non-English text, you could probably just mine non-English from some social networking site (like myspace or facebook), where people tend to list their genders. I'm not sure how to do it for speech. Maybe there's some speech transcription corpus out there that's annotated with gender, but I don't know what it is. Although I don't see a huge financial marked out there for an answer, I'm personally curious what it is about my English writing patterns that made the web site I refered to earlier strongly convinced that I'm male, and what it is about my Japanese speech patterns that make it clear that I'm not.

05 September 2007

Word order and what-not

I've recently been looking at some linguistic issues related to word order phenomena. This is somewhat inline with the implicational universals stuff that I am working on with Lyle Campbell, but also somewhat tangential.

Here's a little background.

Most linguists tend to believe in things like nouns, verbs, adjectives, subjects and objects, genitives, adpositions (prepositions and postpositions), etc. Indeed, these are some of the basic building blocks of typological studies of word order. A common example is that languages that are OV (i.e., the object precedes the verb) are also postpositional (think Hindi or Japanese). On the other hand, VO languages are also prepositional (think English).

The general set of orders that are considered important are: V/O, Adj/N, Gen/N, PrepP/PostP and a few others. However, one of these is underspecified. In particular, PrepP/PostP tells us nothing about the placement of the embedded clause with respect to its head.

For instance, in English, which is PrepP, the head precedes the PP ("The man *with* the axe", axe comes after man). Or, in Japanese, which is PostP, the head comes after the PP (glossed: "the axe *with* the man" -- meaning that the man has the axe). However, it is unclear if other orders are possible. For instance, are there PrepP languages for which "with the axe" ("with" has to come before "the axe" in a PrepP language) precedes "the man", something like "with the axe the man". Or, are there PostP languages for which "the axe-with" comes after the head ("the man the axe-with"). I certainly don't know any, but I know enough about maybe 4 or 5 languages out of around 7000 to tell. It seems like interpretation in such a language would be difficult, but of course that doesn't stop German from separating verbs and auxiliaries and indeed Germans don't seem to have a hard time understanding each other.

A second thing that is left unanswered is how these relate to each other. Consider Gen/N and Adj/N. If you are a GenN + AdjN language, which comes first? In English, the Gen has to ("The man's happy brother" not "The happy man's brother" -- the latter means that it's the man, not the brother, who is happy). Is this reversible for a given language, or are the any languages that allow both? Again, it seems like it would make interpretation difficult.

I've asked the few typologists that I know these two questions and they actually haven't known. I'm hoping that a query to the blogosphere (a word I hate) and a query to linguist-list will turn up something. I'll post anything I hear here.